1) Name and former job

I am Maxwell Lee, co-founder and director of Glocal Network, a real estate investment company. Prior to that I was a freelance musician and also the general manager of the Ritz Chamber Music Society, an international chamber music ensemble dedicated to promoting and achieving diversity in classical music. My wife is Kelly Lei, also the co-founder of Glocal Network and previously an engineer and project manager at The Raytheon Company. 

2) How would you describe FIRE? 

I am driven by my gut feeling more than data analysis, and for me the goal has always been to have the feeling of freedom and flexibility with both time and money (and location, but that’s perhaps off topic). I wasn’t even aware of the FIRE label until we had pretty much achieved it. 

Being a part of the real estate investment industry, where “passive income” is THE buzzword, we were just focused on increasing our rental income, and with each step/property came a little more freedom and flexibility. 

3) How did you know when you reached FIRE? Was there a number or was it something else?

To me FIRE is not only black and white. There is a gray area…and we are in that gray area. Some folks would call this lean-FIRE. Our family can survive on our passive income alone, and we don’t have to worry about a roof over our heads or food on the table. That is a blessing that I cannot overstate and that we don’t take for granted. But without any other income we could not invest in projects we like, donate to causes we support, participate in hobbies, travel, save money for emergencies, etc. So we’ve achieved the number we need to survive, but not to live the way we want. 

But given my definition of FIRE being a feeling, I guess the moment we knew we “reached it” was when my wife Kelly decided to become a teacher (and absorb an enormous pay cut as a result) simply because it was her dream since she was a child. At that point, our big life decisions were no longer motivated primarily by finances. 

4) How has your approach to money changed since becoming FI?

This wasn’t exactly a light bulb moment that suddenly clicked after achieving FI, but during the overall path to financial independence I came to eventually recognize that time is waayyy more important than money. Time is finite while money is abundant. Sure this is obvious and I’ve always “known” this, but it took years of experiences on this FI journey for me to really begin to understand and appreciate it. 

5) What have been some of your passion projects? Do they make money?

I have only recently begun to pursue my passion projects, which include blogging, vlogging, and podcasting about topics ranging from travel to urban planning. However, my primary passion is music and I’ve been gradually returning to performing, composing, and collaborating on a number of artistic endeavors. Many ages ago, before our real estate business, I was making some money in music so I do have modest expectations to do so again. But it is a huge relief that now it would merely be supplemental income and it is no longer necessary to make a living/career in music. 

Kelly left our company several years ago to pursue her passion projects. Initially teaching and coaching high school math, she soon pivoted into her new business as a professional coach, where she teaches and coaches emerging leaders and works with many startups. She’ll also be releasing her own podcast featuring successful leaders sharing their often inelegant paths to success. I’ve watched as she’s methodically turned this passion into a full-fledged business. 

6) What would you say to someone who is interested in pursuing FIRE?

Do your research, follow your plan, and then don’t be afraid to make some mistakes. If you have a job that you like, then keep it for as long as possible. We recommend creating as many income streams as possible and, given our background,  seriously considering real estate investment as part of that equation. As my wife advises: Increase your wealth creation power so you are not only financially independent, but also financially confident.